Boutiquehotels: mensen eerst, techniek als hulp

"the Future of Hospitality (00:00) We're to it in restaurant. Okay, there we go. Three, two, and one. Welcome to our podcast, The Future of Hospitality. I am your host, Arjen Eickelabon. Today's guest designed her own hotel as a little girl. And today she's actually doing it for real. From leading iconic properties to building boutique hotels with soul. She's redefining what guest experience means. Later, we'll hear how she breathes new life into tired hotels. and why she believes boutique hotels are the future of urban tourism. Nicolene Montanus, director of Arc Hotels with a Q. Welcome to our show, Nicolene. Nicoline Montanus (00:38) Thank you so much and thank you for inviting me on this beautiful day here and I'm really looking forward to this podcast show. the Future of Hospitality (00:49) ⁓ I was thinking the same thing, let's shine. There we go. ⁓ Let me just ask you straight this question. What does a 10 out of 10 guest experience mean to you? Nicoline Montanus (01:05) Well, of course it's different for everybody, for me it really... What really is important and gives the 10 out of 10 is attention from people who work there and their love for our job, which brings us back to the really core of hospitality is be seen, the value of acknowledgement. I think that's... ⁓ For me, the most important ⁓ part of my stay that people are really happy to see me and want to give me a very warm welcome. And ⁓ the other very important point ⁓ is cleanliness, which brings me to the point how important staff is in our job, that our housekeeping team. the Future of Hospitality (01:58) Mmm. Nicoline Montanus (02:00) is super important because if your room is not clean, you feel not acknowledged. So there are actually two points which are for me very important. the Future of Hospitality (02:13) ⁓ I see what you mean. You know what? I never thought about that. But if it's not really, really pristine clean as we clean as we want it, it feels like they didn't do their other best for me. That's what you're saying. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I like that. You're right. Right. Absolutely right. Other question. If I would give you 50 K today for one hotel improvement, where would you spend it first? Nicoline Montanus (02:25) Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. ⁓ That's an interesting question actually. You would think people will say give me a luxury spa or private dining or new airco. I don't know but I, we from ARK really believe that it all starts with our staff and with people, so the guests and our employees. I would go to a really fancy restaurant with my staff and enjoy the evening and show my staff that I really appreciate them. And if there's some money left of the 50k... Yeah, exactly. We go to the bar and dance all night long. And then I would say spend it to comfortable... the Future of Hospitality (03:22) You We go out for a drink. Yeah. Nicoline Montanus (03:37) to comfort our guests and that is in the beds. So really good ⁓ duvets, really good pillows, because that's what can make or break a stay of our guests. the Future of Hospitality (03:54) Okay, again, you're absolutely right. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. ⁓ a few duvet cover sets, come on. I mean, a good mattress. All right. ⁓ A few short ones, I will fire at you just to keep the energy going because I really like this. What you said about indeed the mattress, I was like, you know what? Pillows, that's the first thing I... Nicoline Montanus (03:54) Then I think the 50k is done already. Yeah, and after the dinner it's done, yeah. the Future of Hospitality (04:21) I think about when I go sit in the bed of a hotel, I feel, okay, how does it sit? How do the pillows fit? Okay, okay. I like it or not? Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, you're absolutely right. I mean, I could just picture myself doing that exact thing. ⁓ Favorite boutique hotel, not one of your own. Nicoline Montanus (04:30) Yeah, sure. Yeah. Well, I ⁓ stayed this summer in a fantastic, I would really recommend you going there. It's called Agave in Central, it's in Milan in Italy. Wow, what she does over there, she's by herself. The owner started ⁓ in Florence, ⁓ she made a ⁓ farm and she... transformed it to a small boutique hotel. And what she does is actually what I really like is ⁓ guests come in and well, she's almost embracing you, but she will help you with the luggage and her staff as well. She's really committed to everybody who's coming in. I want to know you, what are you going to do? I'm going to bring you to the room. Is everything okay? And we were there with a lot of kids and a dog and we drove ⁓ hundreds of miles. It was hot and she just did it perfectly and it's a really small boutique hotel in the super center of Milan. I think that's a very good example of doing what you love in your job. the Future of Hospitality (05:55) Yeah, I think what you just described is the core of organic natural hospitality. Because I mean, the location Italy, mean, she probably built the whole thing herself from maybe maybe not from scratch. But I what I'm hearing is some someone who, okay, this is mine, and I'm going to do it the best way possible, which is something to be honest that I dreamt I was dreaming of that when I was really, really, really young, probably the same as I was. Nicoline Montanus (06:21) Aww. the Future of Hospitality (06:24) I want to do it, I want to have a restaurant and I remember that restaurant with only a few tables and the finest dishes. I think that is a dream of a lot of people and only a few make that happen. But I think that lady, indeed, that is what ⁓ I feel, that lady want to give it, wants to make you feel ⁓ as comfortable as possible. And she did. Nicoline Montanus (06:45) Yeah, that's what the nice thing is of ⁓ boutique hotels or being able to give the attention to your guests that specifically and that personal because you don't have to check in 200 rooms and you really want to see it all and you want to embrace the hotel and you want to experience your stay instead of the Future of Hospitality (07:02) Hmm. Nicoline Montanus (07:13) checking in and get your own pillow out of your suitcase and hopefully the airco will work, that's not what you want. In this time, the experience of being in a hotel is way different than ⁓ in the past. Yeah, for sure. the Future of Hospitality (07:29) So things are changing. We're going to talk about that. First, I want to know from you, what is the best city for boutique hotels? Nicoline Montanus (07:40) That's a really hard question actually, Arjen. I can't choose because I really love The Hague, it's so different, it's a beautiful city, it's near the beach, but I live in The Hague, so it's really nice. We've been in Milan, but also it's, you would say, a capital of a town or from a country. because the Future of Hospitality (08:08) Yeah. Nicoline Montanus (08:09) that's where the magic happens mostly. Of course also in really small villages. the Future of Hospitality (08:12) Mm-hmm. Nicoline Montanus (08:18) I would also say go to the mountains. I can't choose. It's too hard. But I think it actually doesn't really matter in which city you are, because hospitality is hospitality and you can do it either in the mountains or in the woods or in the beach or in the city. The experience will be made also by the people who working there. I can't choose. I will get back to you, okay, on that answer. the Future of Hospitality (08:21) Okay. Mmm. Yeah, yeah, No, yeah, yeah. No, that's good. Well, you know what? You made it perfectly clear. doesn't, the destination decides what, ⁓ no, how do I say that? It's not always about the destination. It's about the place where you stay and how the people are welcoming you. That is more important than the destination. All right. ⁓ The biggest waste of money in hotel design. Nicoline Montanus (08:48) You I think food cost. think it's... Our footprint in hotels is super huge. We spend a lot of water by cleaning all the linen. We spend a lot of electricity because you want to have the lights on when people come in at night. So our footprint is quite big. the Future of Hospitality (09:19) Okay. Nicoline Montanus (09:42) And I think it's our responsibility in hospitality that ⁓ we should minimize it where possible. And that's where the food costs and the waste come in. Breakfast is a really important start of the day. And for boutique hotels, it's actually the second point where you are able to talk to your guests. the Future of Hospitality (09:59) Mm-hmm. Nicoline Montanus (10:09) So you want to have a fantastic breakfast. But we all know breakfasts are huge buffets and everything will be thrown away afterwards. I think it's a waste of money and I don't think you need it all. So I would almost teach people when they stay in hotels, accept a small breakfast. the Future of Hospitality (10:25) Think so too. Nicoline Montanus (10:37) And when you do want to have a big breakfast, ask for it so we can make it personal. But I think a food waste is a waste of money and a waste of environment. So we should really... Yeah, for sure. Well, our guests as well, because they all... A lot of people say, I stayed in Hotel XIC and the breakfast was moi, because there was not a lot... the Future of Hospitality (10:49) Mm-hmm. A lot of hotels can learn from that. Yeah. Nicoline Montanus (11:07) on the breakfast. No, we don't put a lot of things on the breakfast because otherwise we have to throw it away. It's there, but you can always ask for more, but we should change the mind of our guests as well. Lower your expectation due to the environment. You can still have a fantastic breakfast, but not in, how do you say it, in overflood? the Future of Hospitality (11:13) Yeah, no, I see it. Mmm. ⁓ an abundance Nicoline Montanus (11:38) Yeah, exactly. So I think it's a two-way thing we have to talk about, but it's really a waste of money and food and meat and everything. the Future of Hospitality (11:46) Yeah. Yeah, I see what you mean, especially if it's not that busy. There's that food is sitting there for Peter, as we say Dutch, and then you have to throw it out. Yeah, yeah, I remember. Nicoline Montanus (11:58) Yeah, exactly, that's it. you want to have a fantastic wow breakfast. So you put a lot of like 50 croissants on your buffet while you only have 15 guests in your house, because it looks wow. Yeah, and at the end it will be thrown away. the Future of Hospitality (12:11) Hmm. I remember the first trip I did with my husband years and years ago, went to, I think it was Disney Orlando was our first trip together. And we stayed at a hotel at breakfast and we're on our way to the first day in the parks. And I turned around and said, look at the breakfast room. all the tables were full of plates, full of food. mean, that's the other thing people put so much food on their plates, ordered extra food, didn't even eat it. I said, look at all that waste. And it basically made me sad. So I totally get what you mean. Yeah. All right. Nikolay, what first drew you to hospitality as a child? Was there a specific moment you knew this is going to be my path? Nicoline Montanus (13:10) Yeah, I knew, I actually knew. My mom did a hotel school in Switzerland, but she never pushed me to do hotel school. But I remember when I was around nine, I really liked playing Hoteletje in our house. So I made a reception of the dining room. the Future of Hospitality (13:12) Okay, go ahead. Nicoline Montanus (13:37) I made hotel rooms in the kitchen and in the toilet and I had my own breakfast room and I really liked playing Hotelitje when I was really young. But I also know that I made a... ⁓ I drew my own hotel when I was very young and I still hope when I grow up that I can... one time opened my own hotel, which I totally designed when I was nine, because it was so cool, it so, it was a nice building and you enter the hotel lobby and you look up and you see different floors and on every floor there was a different theme, ⁓ like a country or a feeling or music or, but especially what I've What I already felt when I was really young was when you enter a hotel you instantly feel love and warmth or you don't. ⁓ So you instantly feel at home or you don't. And I remember that when I was drawing that picture of the hotel that's what I wanted to do when I grow up. give people the feeling that when you come in, come in! I will not embrace you but please do come in, it's so nice here and I solve all your problems. I mean you sleep fantastic, you have nice food and you feel the warmth in my hotel. So yeah, I was quite young when I experienced ⁓ this feeling. the Future of Hospitality (15:17) Wow. Do you still have that drawing? Nicoline Montanus (15:25) Well, I have to look it up at my parents' house. I think I do. My mom never throws things away, so I have to find it because it should be actually hanging on my wall. It's so nice. Yeah. the Future of Hospitality (15:26) The design. Yeah, you should. think you should. ⁓ Because that's when it started. ⁓ So that specific moment you knew that's going to be what I want to know is, how did it, do you think it affected or has, ⁓ how did it shape you, how you lead today? Nicoline Montanus (15:51) Yep. Yeah, also with my character I'm I think I'm arrogant enough to say that I'm a people manager and giving warmth to a building is quite hard because a building is not alive. So what makes a building alive is the people who are in it. I always ⁓ respected my leaders who made me feel important, that I really was a ⁓ bullet of the chain, I was important in the whole process of the guests coming in. And that's what I learned quite young in my career. And that shaped me because the feeling I had as an employee in a hotel, I really wanted to give that feeling to my staff or to my employees or to my team, because they do the hard work. They are there every day. enjoying our guests and I really think it's important to make them feel acknowledged and valued. the Future of Hospitality (17:25) What you described to me is like ⁓ the owner of that hotel you went to in Italy. You want to be that? You want to be... Yeah, that's what I mean. So how do you yourself design a system around your 10 out of 10 guest experience vision? Nicoline Montanus (17:31) Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. And what kind of system is it what you mean then? the Future of Hospitality (17:50) ⁓ to, to, to, to achieve that 10 out of 10, how do you create your own system to make that happen? Nicoline Montanus (18:00) ⁓ Well, it again starts with our staff, with our team. ⁓ It empowers the team to ⁓ grow, but also have them involved in the concept we have. And if you don't like the concept, please find a concept which you like, because otherwise you are not happy in my team. ⁓ the Future of Hospitality (18:05) There we go. Nicoline Montanus (18:29) but happiness is, it sounds a bit, yeah, yeah, happiness, but it's really important because they have to be in our hotels for many, many hours and you want to have a happy life. So I think the system starts with happy guests, happy staff, ⁓ and the rest will follow. So I think that's actually the most important thing, point of a system. the Future of Hospitality (18:57) Okay, so what inspired you ARK with the Cube ARK Hotels and how is it different from other collections out there? Nicoline Montanus (19:07) ARC with Q, because it stands for the Q of Quality, exactly. That's where it comes from actually. Well, what differs us, or ARC, from other hotels is mostly because we believe in smaller hotels. Smaller hotels are more able to be the Future of Hospitality (19:11) Okay, I'm glad you said that. Nicoline Montanus (19:36) in the feeling of the city where they're at. So they work with locals, local companies or local restaurants. They are more able to be an ambassador of the city and that gives the full experience to guests when they stay in a small hotel. Because they just are, yeah, they have more flavors of the city. the Future of Hospitality (19:53) what you mean. Nicoline Montanus (20:05) in their little building and also are able to work with the bakery around the corner or ⁓ you know get your vegetables ⁓ just around the corner because you don't have to feed 200 guests you're able to feed 40 but do it fantastic or the Future of Hospitality (20:08) Yeah. Mmm. Nicoline Montanus (20:32) work with ⁓ a small farm around somewhere in the neighborhood. So the choices you can make are ⁓ more designed than when you have a big chain hotel. And that's where the love of the hospitality comes in. And that's why Arc is so fantastic, because we are able to make those choices. Better make a good choice than 10 quick choices because of the costs. the Future of Hospitality (21:01) And you put that little girl vision in there every day. Nicoline Montanus (21:07) Every single day. Yeah, and I hope my team will will acknowledge this as well. Yeah, that's true the Future of Hospitality (21:15) When you take over a, as we call it, a tired property, what's your very first move? Nicoline Montanus (21:24) Well, that's an interesting one, because if I visualize it, we take over hotels at this moment because we are growing as ARC Hotels is a new young hotel label. So we see a lot of hotels and in my career, I've been on the other side of the table. So I was the one who was taken over by companies. And what I actually always missed was the interest in us. What are you doing here? Do you like it here? How do you feel? What do you like most working for this hotel or for this chain? Just the, not really just, but the human interest. So if I come in, when you take over a hotel, it's exciting for me, but for the team, it's terrifying, they lose their confidence, they don't know what's happening, it's all... No, you have no clue! Yeah, they say they're not going to change anything, but of course they will change things, because they come in and they want to improve things, you know? Yeah, so you feel really uncertain and when you are uncertain as a person, you're not happy. Because it's... the Future of Hospitality (22:24) Yeah, yeah, ⁓ Because you don't know, yeah. I've been in that position and no... Yeah, everything will change. Nicoline Montanus (22:52) it's terrifying, it's scary, will I have my job in another year? Or I have my mortgage to pay? It goes much further than the line, than I will take over a hotel. So when I step in a hotel, the first thing I do is just talk. Talk to the staff and make them feel okay and that they are able to tell me their thoughts, their terrifying thoughts or whatever. Just build trust within a team. And actually that's the most fantastic thing to do. To get the connection with the team the Future of Hospitality (23:32) Mm-hmm. Hmm. Nicoline Montanus (23:48) and arc I think that's the greatest thing I like yeah and then the magic happens yeah the Future of Hospitality (23:52) Ting ting this, yeah. See what you mean. Yeah, yeah. So that's the same challenge over and over again when you take over hotel. It's like, okay, show time. What's gonna happen here? Nicoline Montanus (24:01) Yeah, yeah. Yeah, and of course we look at the building and everything and all the law and is everything okay? But my colleagues will take that responsibility and I'm here for staff, guests, and yeah, to get the best out of the staff in the new way, but without terrifying them. in the first days. the Future of Hospitality (24:34) Yeah. So you touch something and you repeated the same word a few times. So that means that you've probably experienced this yourself, the terrifying part, the be taken over part. You mentioned it before. So can you walk us through the moment that you worked at a property and it was being taken over? Nicoline Montanus (25:01) Yeah, well, we've been taken over quite some times, or little hotels been taken over. the Future of Hospitality (25:08) Mm-hmm. Nicoline Montanus (25:12) I think ⁓ the biggest difference is in the takeovers we do right now and which I experienced in the past is who is taking over you? Which company? Is it a big company who's far away from where we are and have no clue? Which is also totally fine, because that's one way to look at the Future of Hospitality (25:37) Mm-hmm. Nicoline Montanus (25:42) it and I have the privilege to do it in a different way. nothing, what I want to say is nothing is good or wrong, but I think I feel more comfortable by doing it our way, instead of without any compassion. ⁓ the Future of Hospitality (26:03) Mm-hmm. It's all about compassion and feeling seen. think that's the threat that, ⁓ Nicoline Montanus (26:07) Yeah, yeah. That's for me the loop or the way to look at hospitality. the Future of Hospitality (26:15) Let us walk through a hotel that you took over at some point. What was the state when you arrived and what did you do to transform it? Nicoline Montanus (26:27) Well, we've taken over a hotel which we have totally renovated. We were able to close the hotel and tear it down from the inside and build it up again with a whole new concept in it. We took over that hotel which was run by a super dedicated manager. ⁓ for 10 years. And you saw the love in the building. It was really good, well stated actually with paint and with the fabrics, there was no damage and everything. But what you see is that the concept we wanted to have in that hotel, we were not able to... the Future of Hospitality (27:04) Mm-hmm. Nicoline Montanus (27:25) to have that concept, we needed to renovate in order to have the concept in it. And the building we just recently renovated was a ⁓ home of a very well-known writer here in Holland. And that specific writer wanted to... I was looking for... the Future of Hospitality (27:34) Mmm. Nicoline Montanus (27:51) a place where his sister lived with a family and he wanted to stay there because he didn't feel at home with his parents. So he was looking for a building where he felt at home. And exactly that little thing was the start of the concept. So we had to tear down the first of the main floor to have a kitchen, living room. So we were actually able to do that and the whole concept is in right now and it's fantastic. It's great to see. the Future of Hospitality (28:29) It sounds like you brought the soul back into the property. Nicoline Montanus (28:35) Yeah, exactly, that's what I was looking for. yeah, exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. the Future of Hospitality (28:39) Yeah. nice, nice one. Something else completely soulless, I would say. But it's also something you are very ⁓ experienced in is ⁓ the IT part in hospitality. Do you think you could tell me a bit more or tell us a bit more about that. But do you think is ⁓ digitalization, is it a threat or a threat to boutique hospitality? Nicoline Montanus (29:06) Well, ⁓ we in art believe that ⁓ digitalization should be a tool to help people instead of replace people. What you see in small hotels is that there's a lot of ⁓ things being done repeatedly which could be very efficient if you do it digital, in a digital way, because it is a waste of time. It's more important to open the door to a guest and talk to them instead of do repeatedly things or tasks which can be done by AI. So it is... for sure not a threat. I see it as a... yeah. the Future of Hospitality (30:03) ⁓ It's a tool to make the whole guest experience even better. So we should turn it around. Nicoline Montanus (30:09) Yeah, it's just a tool to support the human touch. And I even think it will give more comfort to guests, because I'm actually, I don't know how you feel about it, but if I enter a hotel and I have to stand in line for about 7-8 minutes, I've not been recognized or, hi guest! I will be with you shortly. So I just wait there for seven minutes. I'm done already. mean... And now I can do it from my home. Exactly! You get more annoyed. Yeah, you get... And it's even five or six minutes, but you get, you get annoyed. And they're only staying like... standing like this. You only see their forehead and they're not really interested in what you're going to do here. the Future of Hospitality (30:44) yeah. The tick that it's the time bomb. Tick tock, tick tock, tick tock. Okay. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Nicoline Montanus (31:07) So we believe that the digital part can help our staff and our teams to hello our guests, because things will be done by AI and it's possible to have it done by AI. the Future of Hospitality (31:25) So that part, the front desk, a lot of admin part should be and well has to be replaced at some point by modern technology in order for the people behind the counter. I I fully agree at least, but that's also the skill sets of the people there. They need to, no matter how busy it is, always say hi. I mean, I remember that from 40 years ago when the door opens up the restaurant. No matter how busy you are, no matter how many plates you got in your hands or whatever, it's always good afternoon. I'll be there in a second, whatever. I mean, you acknowledge the person for being there. You make people feel seen. That's more important. Then it's okay to wait for another five or 10 minutes. Can you please wait? You see I'm busy. Okay, no problem. Go ahead, go ahead. I'll wait. That is what you mean. And AI can take whatever they're busy with. but it can probably be done more efficient with the use of modern technology. Yeah, it's good mix of both. ⁓ Nicoline Montanus (32:29) Well, and what you see as well with AI is that we sometimes do tasks because we already do them for 500 years and we should, did this ⁓ obliged us? We have to check our tasks and consider do we still need to do these tasks or can we do them more efficient or can we lose doing these tasks because it's why are we doing things? So it makes you think ⁓ or consider again doing tasks or efficiently or leave it and spend your time to more important things than ⁓ fill out sheets which the computer can do. Yeah, I really totally believe in AI. the Future of Hospitality (33:00) Mm-hmm. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. That's good to hear. ⁓ it's when you arrive, yeah, you want to be seen. But what I also experienced myself at times, at too many times actually not thinking about it is when you leave a hotel, ⁓ because there's automatic checkouts, ⁓ there's someone else behind the counter. That's all right. But you want to say thank you and goodbye. And Sometimes I don't get the opportunity to do that. missed, it feels like a missed opportunity. It's same when you leave a fine dining restaurant ⁓ and if there's no one at the door, I feel, hmm, cause you need, it's like when you, it's cold. Yeah. Just like leaving a plane, there's always the flight attendants, sometimes even the pilot. And that is, that makes it complete. But I feel the same when leaving a restaurant, leaving an hotel that should. Nicoline Montanus (33:59) bit cold. the Future of Hospitality (34:14) be a point of attention as well, ⁓ arriving and leaving, but it's my personal opinion. Okay. Yeah, yeah. You also ⁓ play a role, like you are the voice of smaller hotels in the city of The Hague for the council. Can you tell me a bit about that? Nicoline Montanus (34:17) Sure. I totally agree. Yeah, sure I can. What I see is that in ⁓ cities we have of course our big hotels and big hotels with big chains. They have a big head office behind them, but little hotels are coming up and little hotels could be boutique hotels, 20 to 40 rooms, because we notice that guests, and I feel it myself as well, if you decide to go to a city, you want to experience your stay instead of ⁓ go to a big hotel and not being seen, or that nobody actually pays attention. And I'm not saying that's the issue with big hotels, because of course they ⁓ do it in their own way. But I believe with small hotels, with smaller or little hotel rooms, there's more time to talk to the guests. And ⁓ guests want to experience that as well. So boutique hotels are ⁓ opening faster and ⁓ are not always at the table with the big hotels, because being ⁓ at the table, you sometimes have to pay for it and it's too expensive for the small hotels. But decisions are being made on those tables. What's happening with the city tax? What's happening with the marketing office from that ⁓ capital or from that city? And even though boutique hotels are very small, the Future of Hospitality (36:16) ⁓ well. Nicoline Montanus (36:37) it's an upcoming brand, so it's really important to listen to them as well. they don't have to be at the table with their 20 boutique hotels, but at least have one at the table, so they can... ⁓ can't find the English word, but then they're able to have one person at the table and to come up for their thoughts and rights as well. Yeah, exactly. the Future of Hospitality (36:58) It's okay. Stronger together, yeah. So I think I know what you mean because what it was ever since the 70s, 80s, I mean, I go back a long time. It's indeed the big hotel brands. Boom, boom, boom. That's hotels. That's what you see. And when you make a jump to today, you see indeed, I see that everywhere. Smaller hotels, boutique hotels, personal, more personal experiences. I mean, You are more connected to your destination. Your destination is almost in the property. It's like the door to, yeah, it's like an indoor garden. Let's ⁓ put it that way. So you are the voice for these small hotels. Do you notice a difference like in the Hague with decision-making already? Nicoline Montanus (37:58) Well, we are now talking getting on the table. We are starting actually with ⁓ meetings with all the boutique hotels. I strongly believe that if we have a voice as boutique hotels and we... ⁓ the Future of Hospitality (38:03) Okay. Nicoline Montanus (38:22) We make a city more interesting with boutique hotels ⁓ for our guests. So I think it's really important to pay attention to those little hotels because all together we might have 600 rooms in boutique hotels and we have laws where we have to pay attention to the Future of Hospitality (38:39) Mm-hmm. True. Nicoline Montanus (38:49) or we want to have ⁓ specific certificates, but which are actually too expensive for the small hotels to pay for. So I also think companies or certificates ⁓ should be able to look to the costs again and see if we can all be equal. the Future of Hospitality (39:12) Yeah, totally see what you mean. Well, it's good you take up on that. It's a heavy task, but you're not afraid to do it. ⁓ Nicoline Montanus (39:22) No, for sure not. And also because I worked in the big hotels myself, which I really loved doing. My whole career was actually built on the bigger hotels. And now I take that experience with me to smaller hotels and try to help them with more knowledge ⁓ and more ⁓ information, actually. the Future of Hospitality (39:43) Wonderful. ⁓ It's 2030. 2030. A guest walks into a boutique hotel. What's different? Nicoline Montanus (39:53) I hope that we are able to inform our guests in those coming five years that digitalization is not afraid, is not something scary. I hope our guests will enjoy smaller breakfasts in five years. are okay with different types of breakfasts. I think AI will take over a lot of things, I hope, but I truly hope that our guests will be okay with that and that they appreciate the attention they get because of AI. that's what I hope in five years that People are more used to digitalization and help us stay... Help the hospi... No, I'm actually saying it the other way around. People really love going away for a weekend or stay somewhere else instead of at home. ⁓ well, I hope we can help each other. We provide the hotels and our guests will help us getting improved or improved. the Future of Hospitality (41:21) Wonderful. Thank you so much for being on our show. Thank you for sharing your passion. That was clear. The passion is there for Boutique Hospitality and Fresh Starts. Everyone can follow us on LinkedIn, Instagram, TikTok, and all the big socials. Also visit our website, futureofhospitality.org, because hospitality is built on heart, not just hardware. Nicoline Montanus (41:33) Thank you for having me. Yeah. the Future of Hospitality (41:56) And we, today, we find the right balance how to get there. Thank you. Nicoline Montanus (42:02) Thank you so much. the Future of Hospitality (42:05) Now good luck to you!.. "